How to teach the Climb command

[Mike D'Abruzzo]

Questions about the "Climb" command can go here.

[ddpowell]

Hi Mike,

I don't have room or an object to do 'climb' on in my place - we're quite restricted by space. Is there another way i can start teaching the predictable chain reaction of commands? I feel like i've pretty much got the rest of phase 1 down and that Manny will be able to handle some phase 2 stuff. She definitely doesn't know climb however so i'm hesitant to move on for obvious reasons.

P.S we're coming to the US in April next year and will be in New York for about 10 days - would be great to come up, see your setup and say hi! (we're coming all the way from South Australia)

Dan

[Mike D'Abruzzo]

Dan,

You can use a dog bed or even a folded up blanket to do "climb". As long as it is an object that is obviously different from the surrounding floor. Having something a little elevated does make it a little easier for the dog though. It is definitely an important and key lesson for you and the dog to master before moving to phase 2.

When you come to New York let us know for sure. We love visitors!

[ddpowell]

Thanks Mike, the issue is mainly space - our biggest room barely lets me move a couple of feet from the climb object and that's after i remove the coffee table from the lounge area ha!. she's one massive pup so just her takes up a fair space and usually she doesn't want to move off the climb object and is content watching me as i walk within a couple of feet her hoping she'll step off!! I could do it outside but she gets too distracted in the park at the moment.

Is there another exercise that doesn't require the space i could also start on? I've started saying 'stop' when she begins to pull ahead on walks - i say 'stop' and then give her a second to pull up, if she doesn't i say 'nooo' just before i stop in my tracks and she obviously gets a correction if she keeps walking because i've stopped. Today we were walking along and i said 'stop', and then 'noooo' as she continued to move ahead and sure enough she wheeled around and came back beside my leg before she hit the end of the lead! Is this teaching her a predictable chain reaction from the command? The difference i could see is that i'm not sure if i've really given her the opportunity to learn what 'stop' means.

Please tell me if i'm way off the mark in my dog-logic here and if you have any other suggestions to start the predictable chain?

[Mike D'Abruzzo]

"climb" is still best because it gives you a chance to teach resistance training, reward, etc.. Just makes thing much easier for both of you. If there is no room in the home, you can find a quiet place outside. Should certainly be easier than trying to teach it during a walk.

For walks it is much easier to teach a formal "heel" after the dog has learned the 'climb" and you taught it with positive reinforcement first.

The formAL "climb" will make it MUCH easier to teach a phase 2 "sit" and 'down". I think it will be worth the trouble to find a spot to teach it, then make the rest of the training more difficult than it has to be. you canb even teach it on an object outside - like a big rock.

[michaelsh]

Questions about the "Climb" command can go here.

Ellie (my dog) is very good at the climbing exercise. It is a little bit crowded in my house with two "platforms" but it works very well. Actually she messes up so rarely that if she does, I find myself quite unprepared so I guess I am messing up more that she does.

I have three questions:

1) Since it is quite crowded inside the house, could I move the platforms outside even if the distractions outside are on a high level and she will likely mess up a lot? Or should I wait until we are much further ahead in the training?

2) I noted that you recommend using a pinch collar for the phase 2 obedience. Can you do it also with a Martingale style collar? Advantages/ Disadvantages?

3) Lastly, I am not yet sure where the Foundation Stage Training is taking us but I let Ellie run free and off-leash a lot in our state park since she is a puppy. I love to see how she runs free, chases squirells and sometimes deer. She always comes back even without calling her. Of course it is a problem when she jumps up on joggers but if I see other people early enough and call her she comes most of the time and so far there is no problem.
My question is: By letting her run off-leash now do I ruin my chances of training her into very reliable off-leash behaviour as I go through the different phases of your obedience training?

Have a good day and keep up the good work

Michael

[Mike D'Abruzzo]

Hi Michael,

To answer your questions:

1. It is fine to move the platforms outside. You might actually be better off if Ellie doesn't mess up in the home. The idea is to be able to teach her the full set of rules that goes along with it, without it being too overwhelming to you or her. If neither seemed overwhelmed you will be good.

2. I don't recommend using a martingale for phase 2 obedience mostly because the collar needs to be used with too much force to motivate the dog for correction purposes. A good alternative to the prong collar is a "good dog" collar. It needs to be used with a little more force than a prong collar to motivate the dog, but it is much less likely to overcorrect the dog if you misjudge. It is great with young dogs, and you can't go wrong starting phase 2 with it.

3. Running free is fine as long as you feel the area is safe and you don't have a dog that is the type to "take off". Refer to the "dog training trinity" in the obedience section of the literature and work on the "+" and "D" stuff and you will have a huge head start.

Hope this helps!

[michaelsh]

Hi Michael,

To answer your questions:

1. It is fine to move the platforms outside. You might actually be better off if Ellie doesn't mess up in the home. The idea is to be able to teach her the full set of rules that goes along with it, without it being too overwhelming to you or her. If neither seemed overwhelmed you will be good.

2. I don't recommend using a martingale for phase 2 obedience mostly because the collar needs to be used with too much force to motivate the dog for correction purposes. A good alternative to the prong collar is a "good dog" collar. It needs to be used with a little more force than a prong collar to motivate the dog, but it is much less likely to overcorrect the dog if you misjudge. It is great with young dogs, and you can't go wrong starting phase 2 with it.

3. Running free is fine as long as you feel the area is safe and you don't have a dog that is the type to "take off". Refer to the "dog training trinity" in the obedience section of the literature and work on the "+" and "D" stuff and you will have a huge head start.

Hope this helps!

Thank you Mike.

The "good dog" collar is the StarMark Training Collar, correct?

The "+" are the rewards (treats and praise), correct?

About the "D": Do you mean, I should try to limit the distractions (as much as that is possible for example by letting her off leash only when it rains because then it is much likely that other people or dogs are around) or do you mean I should let her go back quickly to the distractions after obeying?

[Mike D'Abruzzo]

Hi Michael,

Yeah the Starmark collar listed below is "good dog" collar. I think Starmark is just the amazon seller's name. The good dog collars are also called "triple crown" collars by some people after the company that produces them.

If you login to the selfhelp section, the dog training trinity stuff can be found here:

http://www.selfhelpdogtraining.com/D...enceRules.html

That will answer your questions the best. Hope all is well!

[michaelsh]

and it works great.

I use the star collar with her. And she is very responsive to do it. The slightest correction and she is very obedient. Kind of even scared so that's not good but I really use it lightly and I do not need to use it often even with the higher distraction level outside. I mentioned before that I think she is a sensitive dog.
She is also very good with transitional sits and downs. She totally understands the chain reaction. If she is in down and i tell her "sit" and if she does not do it within 1-2 seconds and I say "no" she nearly jumps in the "sit" to avoid the correction.
One question about the star collar: I did buy the large one but had to remove 3 links so there are just 5 links on it (5 links and the two where the cord runs through). Is that ok (and you might say "obviously" because as described above she reacts very well to it)? Or should I have bought the medium one (but she weighs 52lbs)?

I have a more difficult question concerning the “flexi come” exercise: I bought the flexi 26 foot leash and she is very suspicious of it. Maybe part of it is that the pull (by the spring) on the leash is quite strong so she would not even walk away far enough from me to warrant a “come”. I noticed in your video with Elu that Earl had to make Elu come to him so that there was a distance between Elu and her trainer.
So I threw a stick 15 feet away and then did the flexi-come-procedure. We did this a little bit (like 5 times), then I released her from the leash and we played some and then I called her “come” and she did not come and I said “no” (thinking that she might react to it already even when not on the leash) and she did not come. So I thought “well, I guess that was too fast” and walked to her to put the flexi leash on her again but she expressed a somewhat fearful attitude and walked away and would not let me attach it.
Two more pieces of info about this: Ellie is actually quite good at obeying to the “come”. In the beginning I did a lot of clicker training with her. I just want a higher reliability. So after this situation with the flexi-leash, she would not even come when I waving a treat and put the flexi-leash demonstratively away.
The other piece of info is that she hit the end of the flexi leash a couple of times in full run when I could not react quickly enough. That might have made her fearful/ suspicious to it.
So my questions are:
1) Does it happen that dogs get fearful of those kind of tools and is there a way around it once they are suspicious/ fearful of it or is it better to not use this anymore?
2) Is it common that dogs in a low/ medium distraction level environment react already to the spring force pull of the flexi-leash and do not walk away so that you would actually have to introduce a distraction or move to high distraction level environments?
Thank you in advance for your answers

Michael