high protein diet and dominance aggression?

[abndogos]

OK, I have been reading and found some stuff that supposedly linked a high protein kibble diet to dog aggression. I know there was a study in 2000, that was a while ago. Then I also read about the supplementation of L-tryptophan in a study done at Tufts Vet University that supposedly helped dog aggression. I know not to believe everything I read on the internet, so I was wondering if anyone has heard of this.
http://www.petplace.com/drug-library...alm/page1.aspx

[Mike D'Abruzzo]

I havent personally looked into this heavily but i always brushed it off as most likely linked to high amounts of POOR QUALITY protein which would actually make sense.

High amounts of good protein just doesnt make sense at all.

Poor quality protein, like a dog food with a lot of corn based protein for instance, would have more by-products associated with the breakdown, particularly amonia. That I believe affects the brain and has been known to cause aggression.

Also, how could feeding a good quality protein in high amounts cause aggression when it is what is natural to the dog. If that theory held any merit - then all you would have to do is throw a couple of cups of rice in a raw food and that would lower the protein percentage and magically make the dog less aggressive. Just cant find the sense in that.

But, on the other hand, a poor quality protein is a poor quality protein, no matter what the percentage, and the more the worse because of the toxins from the breakdown.

anyone intrigued by this should look up the information about kidney desease and high protein. Its the same sort of thing.

Many veterinarians that are brainwashed by the science diet company will prescribe a low protein diet, when in actuality protein in itself can actually help repair a kidney, it is poor protein - like that found in science diet, iams, etc in the first place that usually causes the problems (since the same toxins from the breakdown).

So of course less of these poor proteins would be better for the kidneys too - but why not just give normal amounts of a good protein?

remember - I AM NOT A VETERINARIAN. so do your own research.

I have always used Life's Abundance on my aggression cases (with fish oil) and got great results with the training. No bad protein.

Incidently, maybe coincidence, the dogs with the worse impuilse control i dealt with were raised on food like beniful and other purina brands - bad BAD protein.

I would be interested in more in the L-tryptophan. Seems to help with the serotonin levels. My only experience similar is with prozac on one of the client dogs that i was skeptical about at first, but i would definitely say it helps in conjuction with the other training.

[abndogos]

I sat last night and did some searching to see what dog foods had supplemented l-tryptophan, and there were actually quite a few. I wonder why some do and some don't, especially if they are adding all the other essential amino acids. I looked at my dog food, Evo Red meat and here is the nutrient analysis , but no l-trypthophan, go figure? Are the amino acids decreased or lost in the whole processing of kibble? Why I am wondering is that Toro, Fe, and the other dogo I had, Paulo, were/are all fed Evo, and all have dog aggression issues. I had put Toro on St John's Wort about 2 months back to see about the whole serotonin thing, I see a little difference. Now I have to wean off the St John's Wort and slowly add the l-tryptophan as not to cause a serotonin syndrome. I am also gonna start gving some to Fe also, to see what happens.


Moisture 7.50 %
Protein 42.42 %
Fat 22.22 %
Linoleic Acid 1.24 %
Omega 3 0.43 %
Carbohydrates 14.85 %
Fiber 1.82 %
Ash 8.7 %
Calcium 2.09 %
Phosphorous 1.26 %
Magnesium 0.1 %
Sodium 0.43 %
Iron 378 mg/kg
Zinc 200 mg/kg
Copper 18 mg/kg
Iodine 2.8 mg/kg
Manganese 21 mg/kg
Selenium 0.64 mg/kg
Arginine 2.73 %
Histidine 0.95 %
Isoleucine 1.73 %
Leucine 3.35 %
Lysine 2.74 %
Methionine 0.99 %
Met-Cysteine 1.52 %
Phenylalanine 2.04 %
Phe-Tyrosine 3.54 %
Threonine 1.8 %
Valine 2.28 %
Taurine 1060 mg/kg
Choline 1737.89 mg/kg
Vitamin B2 (Riboflavin) 3.58 mg/kg
Vitamin B1 (Thiamine) 3.5 mg/kg
Niacin 31.64 mg/kg
Vitamin B6 (Pyridoxine) 3.86 mg/kg
Folic Acid 0.98 mg/kg
Vitamin B5 (Pantothenic Acid) 18 mg/kg
Biotin 0.07 mg/kg
Vitamin A 16623.81 IU/kg
Ascorbic Acid (Vitamin C) 500 mg/kg
Vitamin D 1620.58 IU/kg
Vitamin E 300 IU/kg

Oh yeah, I totally agree with the whole raw diet and protein thing...and I would say that there is no problems there because the essential amino acids are right there in the raw and they aren't lost in cooking/processing....but maybe the kibble food with higher protein and lost amino acids that aren't being supplemented, esp. l-tryptophan, are causing aggression.

[Mike D'Abruzzo]

It can drive you crazy trying to figure it out. Then again there are dogs that eat kibbles and bits their whole life and they act like Jesus....go figure.

I dont think Toro is all that bad, considering he's a testosterone filled stud of a gladiator type breed. If you raised him on kibbles and bits he may have killed a village of people instead of just pouncing assertive dogs b-lining right for him. Zero dominance aggression or any aggression toward people really, and nothing really toward non-challenging dogs - especially the more he is around them. I was floored how good he (and all the dogs were) at that bark in the park event we did.